# Plastic surgery as a graduation gift?



## MAC is love (May 7, 2007)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17932515...15773?GT1=9951

There's the article from MSN...I've been thinking about this lately. There's a girl at my school (think blonde, blue eyes, rich family...) and I recently found out that her graduation gift is going to be some nice C cup boobs! Apparently her sister also got them as a graduation gift. I don't really care* too* much about plastic surgery, personally I would never do it. It seems that it's mainly for people who think they aren't perfect and if they JUST had this oneeee little tiny thing done they'd look so much better. Again, this is just a personal view. I don't think you're stupid if you've had plastic surgery, btw. My sister had her nose done when she was 17, I believe. Anyway....what are your thoughts on this subject?


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## MiCHiE (May 7, 2007)

How do you know if you'll truly be flat-chested? I didn't get breasts until long after high school, after weight gain, birth control and finally being less active.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

I saw that article...

IMHO... If your not happy with how you look, and it's something diet and exercise can't change, GO FOR IT.

There is no reason to look at yourself in the mirror, and focus on that part of you that deep down inside you HATE (i'm sure everyone has something), and "deal with it."

This has nothing to do with teaching young girls that their worth is in their appearance (plenty of MEN use PSurgery themselves).  It's about helping people have better self esteem.

The whole idea of, "you should be happy with how you were born" is stupid.  There are plenty of reasons people need reconstructive surgeries, cosmetic orotherwise, and if it improves their quality of life, who are we to judge?

For the people who are happy with how they look, good for you 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  And I think for the people who want a little nip-tuck, good for them as well.  I think it's a great graduation gift.  Going into college is a time when everyone needs good self confidence, and how you see yourself, is a big part of it.  Or when you graduate, going into the workforce.  Eigther way, it's a great idea, and more power to those who do it to improve their life.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *♥MiCHiE♥* 

 
_How do you know if you'll truly be flat-chested? I didn't get breasts until long after high school, after weight gain, birth control and finally being less active._

 
What cup size are you may I ask?

And thats rather assumptive.  Many girls do not go on BC, or reduce their activity.  Just because you went on the pill and stopped doing any for of exercise, doesn't mean other will.  And why should you have to get fat to get a few cup sizes?  Not all of us put on weight after highschool.  I'm still around the same weight as what is on my drivers liscense I got when I was 16.  I actually weigh a little less.

FYI, I'm still an Aish Cup.  And I'm 25, WELL after HS.  And I'm on BC.  The booby fairy never gave me a c-cup in the middle of the night, i put my bra under my pillow too =(


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## MAC is love (May 7, 2007)

If people are in need of reconstructive surgery b/c of a car accident or whatever, that's understandable. I just don't understand why so many people are into having plastic surgery like it's no big deal. If you're into that, that's fine I don't have a problem with it. Same goes for people that are okay with themselves, that's cool too.


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## MiCHiE (May 7, 2007)

I'm a DD. But, I ask also because I had a friend who never had any breasts, nor did her mother. She's a full D now, after a pregnancy. I guess if you want to factor all that into the equation before surgery, go for it. Just a thought. Everybody's different.


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## Beauty Mark (May 7, 2007)

I went from a B to a D cup from high school until now and I developed curves. Getting implants is unsettling, because your body may still not be settled.

When I graduated from high school, I'd rather have the money for any kind of surgery for bigger necessities for colleg: computer, book money, spending money so I wouldn't have to work, etc.


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## flowerhead (May 7, 2007)

Well personally I think all plastic surgery (apart from things like breast reduction due to health matters or reconstructive) is really tragic, and fake breasts look horrible anyway.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *♥MiCHiE♥* 

 
_I'm a DD. But, I ask also because I had a friend who never had any breasts, nor did her mother. She's a full D now, after a pregnancy. I guess if you want to factor all that into the equation before surgery, go for it. Just a thought. Everybody's different._

 
Thats a lot of, "what if's" to go through...

Personally I'm considering breast augmentation.  Why?  I can give several parsonal reasons that dont have to do with guy, or society's value on them.

A.)  Clothing options.  I CAN'T wear many styles of clothing, simply because, I dont have much of a cup size, let alone any clevage.  So lots of tops are simply not wearable.  Which sucks.  It's hard enough finding amazing clothing that I really like, finding something I like, that looks terrible, because it was made for someone with B+ cup size, is even worse.

B.) Appearance.  Simply put, women have breasts.  While I'm very thin, so having a small cup size isn't the end of the world in my appearance while wearing clothing, as I can wear a padded bra, and clothing choices that work without any breasts.  When i'm not clothed, it does make me self-concious.  Regardless of i'm with a guy or not at the time.

C.)  Looking more my age.  I joke with my friends that I have the body of a 16 year old, which is pretty much true.  I never got any hips, and I never got any boobs.  While some guys may find that attractive, personally, I want to look like a woman in her 20's.  Not a teenager.

I could give several more...  But those are my top 3.  Is it the end of the world if I don't get a breast aug?  No.  Would I like one?  Absoluteley.


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## MiCHiE (May 7, 2007)

Yeah, that is a lot of "What If's", especially if you're 16-17, but hey....that's life.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_fake breasts look horrible anyway._

 
Really depends on who you go too, and how large of an agumentation you get vs your previous cup size.

If your going to one of those "radio specials" places, yeh, your probably not going to get an amazing result for a breast aug for 2999.99.  If you want good results you have to do the research, and expect to pay around 10k, for a surgeon with a good reputation and who does quality work.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *♥MiCHiE♥* 

 
_Yeah, that is a lot of "What If's", especially if you're 16-17, but hey....that's life._

 
By that same reasoning, you can always get the removed if you suddenly develop DD's later.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_Well personally I think all plastic surgery is really tragic._

 
Whats tragic about it?  

I always find it funny how the people who are against it, really put down those who are considering or have gotten it.

Whats tragic about someone boosting their self esteem and feeling better about how they look?


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MAC is love* 

 
_ I just don't understand why so many people are into having plastic surgery like it's no big deal._

 
It's not a big deal, thats probably why.


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## MAC is love (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_It's not a big deal, thats probably why._

 
Well, not to you. To me it is, I think any kind of surgery is a big deal. Many people don't see it that way. Meh...idk.


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## MAC is love (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_I went from a B to a D cup from high school until now and I developed curves. Getting implants is unsettling, because your body may still not be settled.

When I graduated from high school, I'd rather have the money for any kind of surgery for bigger necessities for colleg: computer, book money, spending money so I wouldn't have to work, etc._

 

I totally agree with you. Personally, I would much rather go out and spend it on like a wardrobe for college or something. When my sister got her nose done, she told my dad that she didn't want a CAR, that she wanted her nose done. She got the car anyway a year later, but I would just much rather use the money for something else. To each their own, though.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MAC is love* 

 
_I totally agree with you. Personally, I would much rather go out and spend it on like a wardrobe for college or something. When my sister got her nose done, she told my dad that she didn't want a CAR, that she wanted her nose done. She got the car anyway a year later, but I would just much rather use the money for something else. To each their own, though. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 
lol way to work the parents 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Was she glad she did her surgery?


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MAC is love* 

 
_Well, not to you. To me it is, I think any kind of surgery is a big deal. Many people don't see it that way. Meh...idk. _

 
Thats because for the most part, they are fairly safe.  Yes, there are possible complications, but everything in life has possible comlpications.  It's probably just as dangerious to get on the freeway, as it is to get surgery.  If anything, the freeway is probably more dangerious.  And if your going to the right surgeon, and doing your research, and not cutting costs, you can have a safe and pleasing result.


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## flowerhead (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_Whats tragic about it?  

I always find it funny how the people who are against it, really put down those who are considering or have gotten it.

Whats tragic about someone boosting their self esteem and feeling better about how they look?_

 
I just think it's really expensive and shallow.


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## little teaser (May 7, 2007)

i personaly dont see anything wrong with a lil plastic surgery i do however think some people get addicted and are extreme and they look bad.
i have had a boob job going on 9 years now and i love them and have zero regrets im even considering getting them replace with silicone implants because they look and feel more natural but when i got mine that wasnt an option for me.. 
plastic surgery is a personal choice that only the person getting it should make, if your against it for whatever reason then thats your choice.


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## little teaser (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_I just think it's really expensive and shallow._

 
some people's rims cost more than boobs but hey if they got the money and can afford it theres nothing shallow about it..
some people have enough mac that can buy rims and tits but who are we to judge if thats what they like to each there own.


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## Dark_Phoenix (May 7, 2007)

Even if it is aesthetic... just do whatever makes you happy 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			




It's your body, if you think there's something that's bothering you (even if it's your breasts), either learn to live with the flaw or correct it.

I had four procedures when I was fifteen and sixteen to eliminate scarring on my right side of my body (not counting skin grafts). Purely aesthetic, I had complete function back in my limbs. The scarring was caused by severe lacerations and burns after an attack in Sharm el-Sheikh, Egypt (car bomber came through the front lobby of the hotel we were checking into). 

Just to add:
The recovery time is VERY long, at least for me it was. 8 months before the swelling went away completely, and I still have scarring (mostly discoloration) on my arms, abdomen, and legs. Do your research and find a good surgeon... can't stress this enough.


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## MAC is love (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_lol way to work the parents 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




Was she glad she did her surgery?_

 
Yep, she was super happy. I think she got it done in Beverly Hills, at a good place...so it came out nicely. She said she had a "shrek" nose or something...haha 

I'm not the type of person that is like, "OMG, NOOOO...it's horrible" I understand that while I might want to spend $3,000 on a wardrobe, someone might want a nose job or whatever. I'm wondering why so many parents agree to it. I'm not sure if I would let my kid do it


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## jerseygirl005 (May 7, 2007)

i was told that breasts are fully grown until you're around 25... i personally don't need implants, but when i'm older i'd probably be interested in a lift. 18 seems soooo young for surgery. it's a shame how superficial society is today.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_I just think it's really expensive and shallow._

 
<shrug>  You'd be surprised how quickly you can save for something if you really want it.  And who are you to judge how peple spend their money?  Not to mention what is expensive to you, might be a trivial expense for another.

As far as shallow.  What exactly is shallow about caring about how you look?  Or wanting to be attractive?  The idea that beauty is only skin deep is such a lie.  Your appearance is EVERYTHING when it comes to how people first percieve you.  And you only have one chance to make a first impression.  You can say you dont care about looks, yours or other people's, but subconchiously, everyone cares.  And we all make subtle changes in our behavior, and choices depending on the appearance of others.  It's not shallow, it's life.  You dont get the chance to know EVERYONE.  And many people wont even give people the chance, based on how they look.  You simply dont have enough time in the day to give everyone a chance.  So we eliminate people from our lives based on what information we can get by looking at them.  And this isn't just limited to your physica attractiveness, but your clothing, posture, projected confidence, who's around you, etc all pay a big role in that, it's a total package.

Realistically, everyone could benefit from a little nip tuck, no one is perfect, and beautiful people get surgery all the time.  But not getting surgery if you REALLY need it is silly.  And some people really benefit from a normalization of a physical feature thats well, not.  Thats like saying I'd rather walk up-hill, instead of take the free shuttle, on priciple!  It's a proven fact, like it or not, that attractive people have an easier life than unattractive ones.  People are more open and willing to associate with beautiful people, they tend to get better jobs, and are paid more.  Not to mention having a larger pool of people to date in life.  Typically you can always date down the ladder if you want, but not up.  Which is why when you look at a couple, they tend to be about as attractive as each other.  Unless some other factor, like wealth, or power, supercedes physical looks.


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## Dark_Phoenix (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *jerseygirl005* 

 
_ it's a shame how superficial society is today._

 
So superficial we're all turning into make-up junkies and MAC addicts


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## jerseygirl005 (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Emma_Frost* 

 
_So superficial we're all turning into make-up junkies and MAC addicts 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 
plastic surgery is wayyyyyy different then putting on make up. you can wash make up off at the end of the day. those saline implants are stuck in there until a doctor takes them out.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MAC is love* 

 
_Yep, she was super happy. I think she got it done in Beverly Hills, at a good place...so it came out nicely. She said she had a "shrek" nose or something...haha 

I'm not the type of person that is like, "OMG, NOOOO...it's horrible" I understand that while I might want to spend $3,000 on a wardrobe, someone might want a nose job or whatever. I'm wondering why so many parents agree to it. I'm not sure if I would let my kid do it_

 
Well part of it, is that more and more people are having surgery, and understand the benefits that it gives to their life.  ESPECIALLY if their child is born with the SAME physical feature (like a nose for example to stay on topic) and has the same objections to it, that the parent had.  Surgery doesn't work on your genes, so if you have a "shrek" nose, and get it fixed, your kids still have a chance at getting the "shrek" nose gene.  So I can understand a parent who after getting surgery and had a positive impact on their life, thinking, "I wish I had done this YEARS ago!"  So when their daughter asks, "Mommy, i HATE my nose!!!  I want to get it fixed."  There is a instant connection based on their own personal expierence having that nose, and how their quality of life improved after getting surgery.  So they are much more willing to consent to surgery for their teen/young adult, than say, parents who have not had any surgery, or view it as "superficial."


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## Dark_Phoenix (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *jerseygirl005* 

 
_plastic surgery is wayyyyyy different then putting on make up. you can wash make up off at the end of the day. those saline implants are stuck in there until a doctor takes them out._

 
Well, they're still highly aesthetic. I know that make-up isn't as permanent or drastic as surgery but it's still wayyyyy superficial.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *jerseygirl005* 

 
_those saline implants are stuck in there until a doctor takes them out._

 
Which isn't really a big deal.  And Saline is so last year =p  Everyone is back on Silicone now.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Emma_Frost* 

 
_Well, they're still highly aesthetic. I know that make-up isn't as permanent or drastic as surgery but it's still wayyyyy superficial._

 
Lots of people get premanent makeup too.


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## jerseygirl005 (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Emma_Frost* 

 
_Well, they're still highly aesthetic. I know that make-up isn't as permanent or drastic as surgery but it's still wayyyyy superficial._

 
not really... make up is suppose to be for *accentuating* your own look, not permantently and drastically changing your appearance. there is a HUGE difference between the two and if you can't see that there is no point to this conversation. fake titties > make-up when it comes to superficiality.


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## KAIA (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_Thats a lot of, "what if's" to go through...

Personally I'm considering breast augmentation.  Why?  I can give several parsonal reasons that dont have to do with guy, or society's value on them.

A.)  Clothing options.  I CAN'T wear many styles of clothing, simply because, I dont have much of a cup size, let alone any clevage.  So lots of tops are simply not wearable.  Which sucks.  It's hard enough finding amazing clothing that I really like, finding something I like, that looks terrible, because it was made for someone with B+ cup size, is even worse.

B.) Appearance.  Simply put, women have breasts.  While I'm very thin, so having a small cup size isn't the end of the world in my appearance while wearing clothing, as I can wear a padded bra, and clothing choices that work without any breasts.  When i'm not clothed, it does make me self-concious.  Regardless of i'm with a guy or not at the time.

C.)  Looking more my age.  I joke with my friends that I have the body of a 16 year old, which is pretty much true.  I never got any hips, and I never got any boobs.  While some guys may find that attractive, personally, I want to look like a woman in her 20's.  Not a teenager.

I could give several more...  But those are my top 3.  Is it the end of the world if I don't get a breast aug?  No.  Would I like one?  Absoluteley._

 
I've been thinking about it too... I can't EVER find the right bra for me first, because i have NO BREAST and i'm not even skinny .. so it looks pretty weird... right now i wear 36A but let me tell you, it is knda tight on my back, and i can not even fill my poor  A cup ..
38AA??? never seen this size ..plus, like you said about the clothing... i swear i don't have any tank top, any strapless... because it looks just bad on me ... 
The ONLY reason i haven't done a breast augmentation is because of the money, but as soon as i can... hell yeah i'll go for it!

And what I think about getting "boobs" as  graduation gift... well as long as the girl is 100% sure about getting one... why not?


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## flowerhead (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_<shrug>  You'd be surprised how quickly you can save for something if you really want it.  And who are you to judge how peple spend their money?  Not to mention what is expensive to you, might be a trivial expense for another.

As far as shallow.  What exactly is shallow about caring about how you look?  Or wanting to be attractive?  The idea that beauty is only skin deep is such a lie.  Your appearance is EVERYTHING when it comes to how people first percieve you.  And you only have one chance to make a first impression.  You can say you dont care about looks, yours or other people's, but subconchiously, everyone cares.  And we all make subtle changes in our behavior, and choices depending on the appearance of others.  It's not shallow, it's life.  You dont get the chance to know EVERYONE.  And many people wont even give people the chance, based on how they look.  You simply dont have enough time in the day to give everyone a chance.  So we eliminate people from our lives based on what information we can get by looking at them.  And this isn't just limited to your physica attractiveness, but your clothing, posture, projected confidence, who's around you, etc all pay a big role in that, it's a total package.

Realistically, everyone could benefit from a little nip tuck, no one is perfect, and beautiful people get surgery all the time.  But not getting surgery if you REALLY need it is silly.  And some people really benefit from a normalization of a physical feature thats well, not.  Thats like saying I'd rather walk up-hill, instead of take the free shuttle, on priciple!  It's a proven fact, like it or not, that attractive people have an easier life than unattractive ones.  People are more open and willing to associate with beautiful people, they tend to get better jobs, and are paid more.  Not to mention having a larger pool of people to date in life.  Typically you can always date down the ladder if you want, but not up.  Which is why when you look at a couple, they tend to be about as attractive as each other.  Unless some other factor, like wealth, or power, supercedes physical looks._

 
This whole post made me extremely angry.
If you aren't want most people consider 'beautiful' who cares? Fuck them!


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## MAC_Pixie04 (May 7, 2007)

I say to each her own, but at the same time getting them after high school graduation (So, 16 to 18 years old?) is just too young to get them.  Your body is still growing and still changing.  Your body could reject the implant because it's trying to grow its own breasts, it's a very dangerous operation to have at such a young age. 
And I don't buy the whole "fix it" nonsense: "My boobs are small and my dad has money...that'll fix it."  I didn't have much of a bustline until after high school either, and now I have even more of one because i'm on birth control, but not by much.  The only plastic surgery I'm thinking of having is to tighten up some loose skin and lift (not augment) my breasts after I reach a 75 lb weight loss goal, and thats a personal choice I'm making to make myself not only look and feel better, but be healthier.  Not because I want to have monstrous breasts at 17.


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MAC_Pixie04* 

 
_The only plastic surgery I'm thinking of having is to tighten up some loose skin and lift (not augment) my breasts after I reach a 75 lb weight loss goal, and thats a personal choice I'm making to make myself not only look and feel better, but be healthier._

 
How is this ANY different than getting a breast aug?  So it's OK for you to get a breast lift to get rid of saggy boobs, so you'll feel better about yourself.  While it's NOT ok for someone who has small breasts, to get an aug for the same reasons?

Nice double standard you have going there.

 Quote:

  Not because I want to have monstrous breasts at 17.  
 
Not all of us want monstrous breasts eigther.  Just because you get an aug, doesn't mean you have to go from an A to a DD.  Not all of us wanna look like Posh Spice


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## Raerae (May 7, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_This whole post made me extremely angry.
If you aren't want most people consider 'beautiful' who cares? Fuck them!_

 
Nah, recommend them to a good surgeon. =p


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## xbeatofangelx (May 7, 2007)

I think that the difference is age... Just graduating high school, many parts of your body aren't completely developed, and that's why people might want to consider waiting, until they see how they turn out. 

On the other hand, other parts don't change, (like your nose), so I don't see why it's not ok!

Plastic surgeons have to make a living somehow don't they?

To each his own.. If it doesn't directly affect you, why put so much energy into hating it?


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## flowerhead (May 7, 2007)

I never actually said I hated it, I just disagree with it


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## 3jane (May 8, 2007)

Not to get into the debate about whether breast implants are good or bad, but I think 17 is probably too young.  Between 17 and now (23), I went from practically flat to C/D-- and that's without gaining significant weight (still fit into my HS jeans), and without ever taking the pill.  Since so many women continue to grow and develop into their 20's, it seems like a gamble.  Why not wait until say, your college graduation?  Maybe you'll only grow into a B, or maybe you'll embrace your body as it is in that time.  Overall, I think it's probably better to wait for the girl to mature physically and mentally/emotionally before trying to fix her self esteem with surgery.

Also, I don't quite understand how parents think to reward their daughters with boobs.  For academic achievment, no less.  What happened to encouraging your child to have self esteem and values that go beyond looks?  God knows the culture at large is already providing enough stress and reenforcement to look a certain way without parents jumping on that bandwagon, too.


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## hoemygosh (May 8, 2007)

you should just accept the way you are. real people wont care about fake boobs or fake anything. and Raerae, you are really pro plastic surgery. there is no need to be perfect. unless you are really that insecure, then surgery probably wont change that.


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## Dark_Phoenix (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *hoemygosh* 

 
_you should just accept the way you are. real people wont care about fake boobs or fake anything._

 
I think most people get plastic surgery to make themselves happy. They're the ones living with what they perceive as a flaw. Heh, and I agree that real people could give a damn about whats fake or real on you... 

If you have the confidence to be happy with how you are (whether it requires plastic surgery or not), that's what stands out to people. Or at least it should.


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## user79 (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_This has nothing to do with teaching young girls that their worth is in their appearance (plenty of MEN use PSurgery themselves).  It's about helping people have better self esteem._

 
I'll say it straight out, I am REALLY AGAINST the casualization of cosmetic surgery and enhancement that is so common in Western society these days, especially in N. America. While it's great to build up someone's self-esteem, I DON'T think surgergy is the way to go about it.

Surgery, imo, is fine if you need reconstructive help (like had a breast augmentation after breast cancer or something, or damaged your nose in an accident), but just going in and fixing a little bit here, a little bit there, I am against it. Why? Because it's focusing pressure on people, women especially, to conform to some kind of ideal set by society as to what is beautiful, and striving towards an ideal that , let's face it, about 95% of people cannot or will never attain naturally. I have great respect for nature and the human body, and changing it for surgery to look like something else, I don't think it is necessary or desirable in the least. And I do think it is objectifying women, because nearly all women for example that have breast OPs end up with huge C or DD cups...which is not the average breast size for women.

 Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_Realistically, everyone could benefit from a little nip tuck, no one is perfect, and beautiful people get surgery all the time.  But not getting surgery if you REALLY need it is silly.  And some people really benefit from a normalization of a physical feature thats well, not._

 
This comment of yours is really bad, imo. To recommend that people SHOULD have surgery to fix something that isn't "perfect" goes so far beyond good taste. You know, some of us actually have enough self-esteem to love our bodies the way they are, imperfections and all, to not feel the need to go under the knife. Why is it silly to NOT have surgery if you have flaws? This is how humans look, only a small percentage of humans actually have flawless genes when it comes to beauty, I'd say everyone falls somewhere in between. It seems like you are recommending that our society turns in a legion or clones that all have perfect figures and face. Well, no thanks to that!!!


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## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

  only a small percentage of humans actually have flawless genes when it comes to beaut  
 
I don't think a single person who alive or dead is flawless. What constitutes beauty is always varying.


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Sorry, but when I can't buy a shirt, no matter what brand, what size, what design, what line, without having it tailored because I've got shoulders but no tits, a breast augmentation is something I'd seriously consider.
It's just as much about aesthetics as it is about practicality, in my case. I don't want tits that fall out of swimsuits. I don't want to grace a Hooters calendar. I simply want to have a proportional body. *shrug*


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## MiCHiE (May 8, 2007)

By all means, I truly think a lot of women have a case....the question is: Should it be done at 16-17 years old?


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

IMO, no, but only because at 16-17 there's not enough life experience to truly grasp the magnitude of the decision. Then again, that depends on the procedure. 
A nose job for a 17 year old with a huge nose? Sure. Because that's something that's never going to change. Boobs because she thinks it's a good idea? Not so much.


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## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

Do 16-17 year olds have the maturity to understand the magnitude of any cosmetic surgery? Even if your nose is going to stay the same, it's still major surgery and aftercare.


----------



## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

That's true.


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## angi (May 8, 2007)

I don't think that it should be done at 17/ 18. Not only is your body still changing, but also the amount that you mature mentally from this time to early 20s is really astonishing. 

I think if someone had given me the option to get breast augmentation at 18, I probably would have gone for it (I'm about an A cup). Now, at 23, there's no way. 

There is nothing wrong with having small breasts, and while I completely understand all of the reasons that people give for wanting breast augmentation (yes, the not being able to find tops that fit properly is annoying!) there also lots of advantages to having small breasts, which over time I have come to appreciate. 

1) My breasts aren't going anywhere. So when I'm older, and women with larger breasts are slowly beginning to sag, mine will still be pretty perfect
2) I don't have to wear a sports bra to the gym- it doesn't hurt me to run.
3) Men talk to my face, not my cleavage. This means I can actually get them to appreciate my INTELLIGENCE (well, sometimes lol!)


----------



## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Have you ever seen a woman with a sagging a cup? It's not pretty. :/


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## little teaser (May 8, 2007)

i can totally understand you guys concern about surgery affecting the changes of the body and its development, i had those concerns too when i had my surgery because, i at the time did want to have one more kid and was concern about my breast changes during pregnacy, honestly though there really wasnt a diffrence other than my boobs went from a c to a dd during pregnacy and i still produce milk.. there was no negative and the positive thing was my boobs snap right back with no sagging. 
honestly. with all plastic surgery it doesnt last forever 5-10 years depending on the procedure you get so thats another reason it is good to wait as long as you can so you have min or no matinence
one good thing about breast implants though is once you buy them the company does give you a 10 year warranty to replace them if something were to go wrong and they pay some of your surgery exspense i forgot how much.


----------



## little teaser (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_Have you ever seen a woman with a sagging a cup? It's not pretty. :/_

 
i agree^ my friend has small sagging a cups from child birth that look like little shrivel pruns


----------



## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

*angi*- On hot, hot summer days people with small chests can go around without bras or get enough support from those shelf-bra shirts. That's a huge benefit.


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## spectrolite (May 8, 2007)

Haha! Well this tale of graduation boobies just seems so stupid and extremely shallow. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 How about using that money to go towards education or a new place, or a holiday to Europe with friends, or something useful? Wow, new boobies for graduation..."Thanks mum and dad! Now I can face the world with confidence and there is nothing I can't handle with these new boobies of mine." 

It just seems odd to reward her education achievement by giving her a breast augmentation. Is that really thier way of showing her how proud they are? It seems like they are just catering to the shallow whim of a juvenile. I suppose I grew up in a really practical (...poor) family who didn't have the money to pay for extravagences like plastic surgery so I can't really appreciate thier situation. 

Oh yes, who am I to judge her and her brand new graduation boobies... Well no one special, but I'm allowed to have an opinion too!

>_<


----------



## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MissChievous* 

 
_This comment of yours is really bad, imo. To recommend that people SHOULD have surgery to fix something that isn't "perfect" goes so far beyond good taste. You know, some of us actually have enough self-esteem to love our bodies the way they are, imperfections and all, to not feel the need to go under the knife. Why is it silly to NOT have surgery if you have flaws? This is how humans look, only a small percentage of humans actually have flawless genes when it comes to beauty, I'd say everyone falls somewhere in between. It seems like you are recommending that our society turns in a legion or clones that all have perfect figures and face. Well, no thanks to that!!!_

 
Actually my comment there was more directed at people with ABNORMAL physical features.  I'm sorry, but if you have a huge nose, or a huge chin, or whatever, it's not something like a big forhead, that yuo can just grow bangs, and cover up to normalize the proportions of your face.  I think surgery in these cases can be VERY positive.

The ONLY people i've seen, who can OWN a huge nose or chin, are men.  We had a guy at one of my jobs who had a big nose, but he OWNED it.  Up in his cube, he had a sign that said, "Big Nose Knows."  But face it, no woman is going to be able to pull that off.  Same with a big chin.  If you look like your Jay Leno's daughter, your probably VERY self conchious of it.  Simply put, having abnormally large physical features is not attractive on a girl.  You can try to tell these people to love themselves, but chances are, there hyper aware of that part of their body, and focus on it.

Also what about people who got teased for having huge ears, or a huge nose, or a huge chin or whatever?  You know who those kids were.  They all had nicknames at school, and people made a POINT to make them aware that they looked different.  So surgery may be very good way to eliminating a constant reminder of something that was painful for a big part of their life.


----------



## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

I find it highly ironic that on a board dedicated to makeup people are indignant about superficiality.


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## *Stargazer* (May 8, 2007)

I think you'll find that a LOT of reputable plastic surgeons WON'T perform a breast augmentation on a girl that is still in her teens. There are too many changes that can take place in that area in your early 20s. 

Myself, I need the opposite. I am in very desperate need of a breast reduction. But I'm not going to do it until I am finished having children and breastfeeding. Why do something only to have to go back under the knife a few years later? And many reputable plastic surgeons would advise me to wait as well.


----------



## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *hoemygosh* 

 
_you should just accept the way you are. real people wont care about fake boobs or fake anything. and Raerae, you are really pro plastic surgery. there is no need to be perfect. unless you are really that insecure, then surgery probably wont change that._

 
I'm Pro people doing whatever they want to themselves to make themselves happy.  I think it's rather judgemental of people to call people who decide to get surgery, or who want it, shallow and superficial.  And not all surgery involves, "fake" implants, be it chin, nose, boobs, cheek, whatever.

Not everyone is getting nip tuck to be perfect.  There are many people who are getting nip-tuck to be normal.  And it's VERY judgemental of people who take for granted being, "normal" to tell those people who aren't, to "deal with it, just accept the way you are."  

Yes, for a lot of people, surgery wont do much to make their lives better.  Getting a bump taken off your nose isn't going to make people like you any more or less.  Getting bigger boobs isn't going to suddenly make you popular.  But.  If it helps their self esteem, just a little, and makes them happier, and more confident, whats the problem?


----------



## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *angi* 

 
_3) Men talk to my face, not my cleavage. This means I can actually get them to appreciate my INTELLIGENCE (well, sometimes lol!)_

 
Lies!

Even with an A cup, guys look at my chest.


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## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_Have you ever seen a woman with a sagging a cup? It's not pretty. :/_

 
Yeh i've seen some the the b4/after pics of somr of those girls who were like flat as a board, but had these little saggy like pouches hanging on their chest.  So sad =(  You can tell they got a little bigger/stretched from childbirth, but then went back to being really tiny, and just had a lot of leftover skin.

Small boobs can sag too. =(


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## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

  Also what about people who got teased for having huge ears, or a huge nose, or a huge chin or whatever? You know who those kids were. They all had nicknames at school, and people made a POINT to make them aware that they looked different. So surgery may be very good way to eliminating a constant reminder of something that was painful for a big part of their life.  
 
But I was teased as a child for being Asian, and I strongly disagree with people getting work done to eliminate any signs of their race.

If you know what you're doing going into it and don't have unrealistic expectations, like bigger boobs will give me a perfect life, I don't have as much of a problem with it. I do have a problem, though, when people rework themselves to be someone completely different (like that show on MTV that had regular people trying to look like various celebrities). It seems very sad to me that some people can't find anything to love about their body or face that they have to become someone completely different. 

I don't think you should base your self-esteem on how you look, though. It's one thing to want implants or wear concealer to look better, but people should love themselves no matter what.

I'm going to be honest and admit I don't exactly understand the difference between a breast cancer patient getting implants than anyone else. On one hand, I understand wanting return to "normal" but aren't they just trying to conform to some normal someone else set up?


----------



## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_I don't think you should base your self-esteem on how you look, though. It's one thing to want implants or wear concealer to look better, but people should love themselves no matter what._

 
We shouldn't, but we often do.
Attractive people are often judged better by first impression, they make more money, get promotions more easily, have an easier time finding a date, score better on interviews, etc. than people deemed "unattractive". 
Self esteem is a layered thing, and looks are part of it, no matter what. :/


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## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

True, but (and maybe this is unfair, because I know I am pretty) I get the impression from some people that their looks are what are keeping them back and that's it. Sometimes, I think good looking people just have confidence that the not so good looking people lack and that's what makes them more attractive.

YMMV, but I've seen enough perfectly beautiful people on the outside who lack so much confidence or zest for life that they're really no better looking than Britney Spears during her unkempt period


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## *Stargazer* (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_ I do have a problem, though, when people rework themselves to be someone completely different (like that show on MTV that had regular people trying to look like various celebrities). It seems very sad to me that some people can't find anything to love about their body or face that they have to become someone completely different. _

 
Those people have serious psychological issues. Many times the only surgeons that will work on them are sketchy, at best.


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## Dark_Phoenix (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_I'm going to be honest and admit I don't exactly understand the difference between a breast cancer patient getting implants than anyone else. On one hand, I understand wanting return to "normal" but aren't they just trying to conform to some normal someone else set up?_

 
Insurance does not cover most plastic surgery that is not done to restore function. i.e. they'll more likely cover a cleft lip surgery than a breast augmentation after cancer. Maybe some of the people who have reconstructive surgery just want to go back to a sense of normalcy, of how they used to look and try to put what happened behind them. 

My initial burn and laceration treatments (including skin grafts) were covered, for the most part. All of my scar revisions have NOT been covered. I could have left them and spent the rest of my life living with them... but my family has the means to pay for the surgeries so I took advantage of my situation.


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## flowerhead (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_I find it highly ironic that on a board dedicated to makeup people are indignant about superficiality._

 
Oh, please. Putting on some eyeliner and mascara is in a completely different boat from getting some bones in your face shaved away. It's not that black and white darling


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Riiiiight.
And how many people do it because it makes them feel good about themselves? 
How many people do it because 'it just feels better'?
How many of us won't leave the house without makeup on? Or liner and gloss?
How many of us won't leave the house without primping somehow?

Why do we do it? 

We want the affirmation and validation of having people acknowledge our looks.
If we were concerned with cleanliness and hygiene, we wouldn't be buggered about it would we? We'd walk around like Pentacostal or fundamental Mormon women, barefaced with moisturizer and unkempt brows. Make-up, hair dye, nailpolish, etc., push up bras, padded panties, Spanx, high heels, etc., none of that is relevant to personal hygiene or cleanliness. It's all done to make us look better and to boost our confidence and self esteem.

Don't deny the superficiality of it, because it's quite blatant as the, (no pun intended), nose on your face, darling.


----------



## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *spectrolite* 

 
_Haha! Well this tale of graduation boobies just seems so stupid and extremely shallow. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 How about using that money to go towards education or a new place, or a holiday to Europe with friends, or something useful? Wow, new boobies for graduation..."Thanks mum and dad! Now I can face the world with confidence and there is nothing I can't handle with these new boobies of mine." _

 
She's probably still getting all of the above.


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## flowerhead (May 8, 2007)

There are varying degrees of superficiality though.


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Emma_Frost* 

 
_Insurance._

 
This isn't always correct. In fact, it's often not, based on the prevalence now of reconstructive surgery after a mastectomy.

Insurance varies from employer to employer, and provider to provider.


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_There are varying degrees of superficiality though._

 
And? How does that affect anything? Flat refusal to go anywhere without makeup on is just as unreasonable as getting plastic surgery early on.


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## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_Riiiiight.
And how many people do it because it makes them feel good about themselves? 
How many people do it because 'it just feels better'?
How many of us won't leave the house without makeup on? Or liner and gloss?
How many of us won't leave the house without primping somehow?

Why do we do it? 

We want the affirmation and validation of having people acknowledge our looks.
If we were concerned with cleanliness and hygiene, we wouldn't be buggered about it would we? We'd walk around like Pentacostal or fundamental Mormon women, barefaced with moisturizer and unkempt brows. Make-up, hair dye, nailpolish, etc., push up bras, padded panties, Spanx, high heels, etc., none of that is relevant to personal hygiene or cleanliness. It's all done to make us look better and to boost our confidence and self esteem.

Don't deny the superficiality of it, because it's quite blatant as the, (no pun intended), nose on your face, darling._

 
Exactly Shimmer.

It's all the same.  Just because you can "take some stuff off" doesn't mean it's any different than having surgery.  It's all done to improve our self image, make us feel more confident, and improve the quality of our lives.

I'd think more people get nose jobs than get breast augs, only because with your breasts, there are easy non surgical alternatives to improving our bustlines.  There is a REASON that pushup bra's are Victorias Secret's *BIGGEST* sellers.  Realistically, if yuor saying getting a breast aug is stupid, but you own a bra that does ANYTHING with your bustline (making it more symetrical, smothing, giving better shape, adding cup size, whatever) your being hypocritical.  If you were not conscerned with the appearance of your bust, you'd just let gravity take it's course.


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## flowerhead (May 8, 2007)

:S I will quite happily leave the house without makeup on, what's that got to do with anything?


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## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_And? How does that affect anything? Flat refusal to go anywhere without makeup on is just as unreasonable as getting plastic surgery early on._

 
Yeh, you should just not shower, or wash your clothing eigther.  It's so superficial to want to smell clean.


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## flowerhead (May 8, 2007)

Haha you are really running out of an argument...


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## Shimmer (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_Yeh, you should just not shower, or wash your clothing eigther.  It's so superficial to want to smell clean._

 
That's a hygiene issue.
There's nothing superficial about that. There's a difference between bathing everyday, maintaining neatly coiffed hair, etc. and putting on makeup, lashes, etc. I think you understood that though.


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## little teaser (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_Haha you are really running out of an argument..._

 
"why" does it even have to be an argument? if you are against plastic surgery its simple, just dont get it. like i said in my post its a personal decision what may be wrong for you may be right for someone else. vice versa


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## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

Shimmer has a point about makeup. I go out without it as often as I do (it's more about artsy painting for me than covering up), but there are many women who are deathly afraid of going outside of the house without a full face of makeup or are unreasonably upset when they get a pimple.

When you're basing your life so much on your looks, whether you have to paint it on every day or you go under the knife, that it spirals into craziness (won't leave the house, irrational breakdowns, absurd beliefs that your life is going to be perfect for having flawless skin, bigger boobs, whatever) is when I have issues with people and believe that they should take the money they're spending on the product or surgery and get themselves the help they need. If you simply want bigger breasts or the latest shade of lipstick, I don't have a problem with it as long as you haven't convinced yourself it's like a life or death matter.


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## mzcelaneous (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_I went from a B to a D cup from high school until now and I developed curves. Getting implants is unsettling, because your body may still not be settled.

When I graduated from high school, I'd rather have the money for any kind of surgery for bigger necessities for colleg: computer, book money, spending money so I wouldn't have to work, etc._

 
Same thing happened to me. The booby fairy came by to visit me after high school. It was my graduation gift from her!


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## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *flowerhead* 

 
_:S I will quite happily leave the house without makeup on, what's that got to do with anything?_

 
Well your like one of those sometimes i dress like a boy, sometimes i dress like a girl.  So It's really not a valid comparison.


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## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_That's a hygiene issue.
There's nothing superficial about that. There's a difference between bathing everyday, maintaining neatly coiffed hair, etc. and putting on makeup, lashes, etc. I think you understood that though._

 
Yeh it was just extreme sarcasm.


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## user79 (May 8, 2007)

Well, I do believe there are varying degrees of making the best of yourself. Putting on some lipstick and mascara to enhance your natural beauty, or wearing a push-up bra to get cleavage for a nice dress, is not in the same boat as going under full narcosis and getting sliced up and butchered like an animal in an OP. (Whenever I see on TV what happens during breast OPs I always think it looks like they are stuffing a turkey! lol)

I don't think we can paint everything that humans do to look good with the same brush. It is much more nuanced. I would also make a differentiation between someone who for example gets a tatoo lasered off, and someone who gets a face lift.

Mainly, the issues I have with this, and this was the point I was trying to make before: Women are actively engaging in and perpetuating the vicious circle that is spun by how society views what women should look like, and making themselves the victims of such pressure. Not only are we as women subjected to intense scrutiny by men, we are also judged equally and if not more by other women, and the more we alter our bodies, the more likely we are to lose touch with what is reality.

I mean, what do you say to the next generation of women when we are aging and we've all had face lifts and boob jobs and nose jobs. What ever happened to the human body? How will we recognize ourselves, and see our surroundings?


I guess this is pretty deep but it's something I've given a lot of thought. And by the way, I also have a small chest and I hate my nose, it is not straight and has a slight hook in it, so I've also thought about surgery when I was younger to get my nose fixes. But now, I would never do it. It's what makes me, me! And I am fine with that, and don't care if other people don't like it. There is a way to find self-confidence within yourself that is independent of what we look like.


----------



## little teaser (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MissChievous* 

 
_Well, I do believe there are varying degrees of making the best of yourself. Putting on some lipstick and mascara to enhance your natural beauty, or wearing a push-up bra to get cleavage for a nice dress, is not in the same boat as going under full narcosis and getting sliced up and butchered like an animal in an OP. (Whenever I see on TV what happens during breast OPs I always think it looks like they are stuffing a turkey! lol)

I don't think we can paint everything that humans do to look good with the same brush. It is much more nuanced. I would also make a differentiation between someone who for example gets a tatoo lasered off, and someone who gets a face lift.

Mainly, the issues I have with this, and this was the point I was trying to make before: Women are actively engaging in and perpetuating the vicious circle that is spun by how society views what women should look like, and making themselves the victims of such pressure. Not only are we as women subjected to intense scrutiny by men, we are also judged equally and if not more by other women, and the more we alter our bodies, the more likely we are to lose touch with what is reality.

I mean, what do you say to the next generation of women when we are aging and we've all had face lifts and boob jobs and nose jobs. What ever happened to the human body? How will we recognize ourselves, and see our surroundings?


I guess this is pretty deep but it's something I've given a lot of thought. And by the way, I also have a small chest and I hate my nose, it is not straight and has a slight hook in it, so I've also thought about surgery when I was younger to get my nose fixes. But now, I would never do it. It's what makes me, me! And I am fine with that, and don't care if other people don't like it. There is a way to find self-confidence within yourself that is independent of what we look like._

 
if everyone look like you i think plastic surgeons would go out of bussiness
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





 i get what you are saying and your correct there are people out there that are so insecure that they just dont know when to stop and they end up looking.. well. like michal jackson lil kim or joan rivers.. moderation is the key to all things that can spiral out of control.. what if a lil surgery help someone to feel confident and makes them happy should they still fall in the catergory of not really careing if someone else likes or approve of there decision to do what makes them happy. even if it ment to fix there nose they hate that stares back at them when they look in the mirrior


----------



## Raerae (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *little teaser* 

 
_if everyone look like you i think plastic surgeons would go out of bussiness
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 
LOL I was thinking the same thing.  It's pretty easy to say, "I would never get surgery, this is what makes me, me!" when your beautiful.  I'm sure you have a forum full of people who would love to be as unattractive as you are


----------



## user79 (May 8, 2007)

Trust me, I am not perfect physically, and like I said, I really do not like my nose, and like you, I also have small boobs that do not suit my tall frame, so I would also have a reason to undergo surgery if I felt it was absolutely necessary.


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## MACHOMULA (May 8, 2007)

I have an appoint right now to have a consultation to have my boobs and nose done.  I think it's whatever floats your boat.  I think some people can get obssessed with it, but aren't we all obssessed with something?


----------



## Beauty Mark (May 8, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *MACHOMULA* 

 
_I have an appoint right now to have a consultation to have my boobs and nose done.  I think it's whatever floats your boat.  I think some people can get obssessed with it, but aren't we all obssessed with something?_

 
Not to the point I allow it to affect other parts of my life, like alienating people or going into extreme debt.


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## Brianne333 (May 9, 2007)

I don't know that I understand why people are arguing about it, because really - we all have the right to a different opinion, no matter what it is!  But from the first post, I think the topic was more about plastic surgery as a grad gift, rather than plastic surgery in general.  

In my personal OPINION I don't agree with that notion.  If someone wants to have it done, that's fine, go right ahead!  To each their own (I wouldn't do it and I have my own feelings on the matter, but that's just me).  But, I guess that I feel like graduation presents were supposed to reflect the road ahead of us and into our adult years.  It almost feels like the emphasis is on the wrong thing there - "Hey congrats on making it through school and getting an education!  Now have some bigger boobs!".  It's not the plastic surgery part that gets me, it's the *timing* I guess.


----------



## makeupgal (May 9, 2007)

I don't see anything wrong with a little tweek, as long as you don't end up looking like that "Cat Lady" person.  That is downright scary!  Even after 2 pregnancies, I still wear the same bra size that I did 20 yrs. ago.


----------



## Raerae (May 9, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Brianne333* 

 
_ It almost feels like the emphasis is on the wrong thing there - "Hey congrats on making it through school and getting an education!  Now have some bigger boobs!".  It's not the plastic surgery part that gets me, it's the *timing* I guess._

 
<shrug> How is this really any different than giving someone a new car?  Or a trip to mexico to party for a week?  At least with a boob job, she'll feel prettier.  Which will improve her self confidence.  Which is valuable in a lot of things.


----------



## charismaticlime (May 9, 2007)

I think getting plastic surgery at a young age is a terrible idea.  I have a deformity where I'm actually missing a muscle in my body, and ever since I was a kid, I've actually considered surgery.  My parents and my doctor always told me that I'm better without it, but I could never get through to thinking the way they did.  I'm quite glad I survived my teenage years without having to go through with surgery, because now I realize that to go under the knife while your body is still growing isn't the smartest idea.  Not only that, but I've grown to love and accept myself just as I am.  If no one else likes the way I look, I could care less.  It's like they say - "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".


----------



## eulchen (May 9, 2007)

the doctors offered my family that i get my ears operated so i wouldnt look like a car with open doors and get laughed at/psychological problems in school. i was 6 by then. i dont think anybody with only school under their belt has a real grasp of life and the necessary experience to decide on such things (there are excemptions i know, but speking in general) with 17/18 im just out or still in the end of puberty. not only does the body still change, but the mind will also make quantum leaps in development the following years. if you really want it, wait some time and then reflect on the subject again.

i understand if there are people that feel the need to do something because it bothers them a lot for a long time, but i really get frustrated at the notion "a little nip/tuck". its a permanent alteration of your body. this is something serious. if you want it, go for it, but be sure and be confident by doing it. i know there are people whos live has changed dramatically for the better after an op, but i do not understand why so many women who i would classify as natural beauties feel the urge to alterate themselves because they arent "perfect" the way they are. why are we supposed to change to something "better"? as charisma said "if it aint broke, dont fix it"

and id like to add that im very happy that the mentality of nip/tuck being something normal most people do hasnt yet reached the area i live in.


----------



## Raerae (May 9, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *eulchen* 

 
_if you really want it, wait some time and then reflect on the subject again._

 
We live in a "on demand" society though.  Pretty tuff when your radio is spamming you with, "Lunch lipo specials."  And financing for as little a $99.00 a month, with a free limo ride to and from surgery!

 Quote:

  i understand if there are people that feel the need to do something because it bothers them a lot for a long time, but i really get frustrated at the notion "a little nip/tuck". its a permanent alteration of your body. this is something serious.  
 
Most cosmetic surgery can be reversed.  Especially if it's an implant.  It just costs some more money to have a revision done.  So it's not necessarily a change that someone has to live with for the rest of their life if after surgery, they change their mind about it a few years down the road.

 Quote:

  but i do not understand why so many women who i would classify as natural beauties feel the urge to alterate themselves because they arent "perfect" the way they are. why are we supposed to change to something "better"? as charisma said "if it aint broke, dont fix it"  
 
Everyone has flaws.  Some people learn to love them, others hate them.  And regardless of your station in life, there is always competition between other people.  So while a average or unattractive person thinks, "why does she need surgery, she's amazing, i'd kill for her body/face!"  The, "natural beauty" to use your words, is comparing herself to other "natural beauties."  And may want to alter a part of her she finds lacking, to make herself prettier than the other girls.  So she can date the hotter/more successful guys, or feel more confident, or whatever the reason is.

 Quote:

  and id like to add that im very happy that the mentality of nip/tuck being something normal most people do hasnt yet reached the area i live in.  
 
It really depends on where you live.  I've visited or have known friends who see getting themselves all "glammed up" as putting on foundation and a little eye liner.  But typically, the majority of the girls that live around them just dont bother with that sort of thing.  So there isn't the pressure to look your "best."  A clean face and your hair pulled back into a pony tail is good enough, since thats what all the girls do.

But if you come to like Hollywod or Beverly Hills, OC, etc.  You see lots and lots of very put together women.  Especially as you get into the wealthier areas.  So the pressure to look amazing is a lot higher.  Designer lables and several hundred dollar shoes/purses is the norm.  So as a result, the demand for surgery to fix the little things is going to go up.  Since you can't just "dress better" to look better than all the girls around you, or you can't put yourself together in the morning and stand out, because everyone is dressed well and put together.  So the next step in looking better, is cosmetic surgery.  Make sure you have an attractive nose, a small chin, perfectly white teeth, overflowing clevage, etc.


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## little teaser (May 9, 2007)

i think if the girl wants a boob job and her parents agree and want to pay for it.. why not, sure she may be young and could wait untill she is older but it really doesnt matter how old you are, tomorrow isnt promise to anyone so live and enjoy life while you still can instead  of worrying about the what ifs..


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## glam8babe (May 9, 2007)

omg! how old is this girl? well i want a boob job but not till im around 21 when the body is fully developed. i would never have one now as im only 17 and my body hasnt stopped growing. She sounds like one of those girls who are gunna get more and more surgery and her parents are encouraging her! JESUS CHRIST what are they gunna do when she gets married? give her a new brain? its very silly gettin a boob job as a present. I onlyt want a boob job for personal reasons not to 'look good' and try and be better than everyone.


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## Urbana (May 9, 2007)

i think she should wait till she finally finish growing up


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## eulchen (May 10, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *glam8babe* 

 
_omg! how old is this girl? well i want a boob job but not till im around 21 when the body is fully developed. i would never have one now as im only 17 and my body hasnt stopped growing. She sounds like one of those girls who are gunna get more and more surgery and her parents are encouraging her! JESUS CHRIST what are they gunna do when she gets married? give her a new brain? its very silly gettin a boob job as a present. I onlyt want a boob job for personal reasons not to 'look good' and try and be better than everyone._

 
thats another aspect youve brought up here... if she gets it as a present, will she appreciate it as much as somebody who waited, saved up and paid for it themselves?


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## User49 (May 10, 2007)

What a crappy graduation gift! Think of all the mac make up you could buy with the money it costs to have your boobs all cut up and bruised out!! Ewww! Or even go on holiday! Fake boobs?:eek2: Where's the good in that?


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## Raerae (May 10, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *eulchen* 

 
_thats another aspect youve brought up here... if she gets it as a present, will she appreciate it as much as somebody who waited, saved up and paid for it themselves?_

 
So you dont appreciate your Christmas/Birthday presents because you didn't pay for them right?


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## Raerae (May 10, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *glitternmyveins* 

 
_What a crappy graduation gift! Think of all the mac make up you could buy with the money it costs to have your boobs all cut up and bruised out!! Ewww! Or even go on holiday! Fake boobs?:eek2: Where's the good in that?  




_

 
LoL...

Bruises go away, and scars are minimal or invisible depending no the point of incision.  

And if you dont have any, there great =p


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## macluver909 (May 10, 2007)

wow its sad how quick people are to judge these days. I agree that a 17 should wait but it doesnt mean i am going to judge and asume that she is shallow, people do things for many different reasons some to enhance their looks some need it. but who are we to judge someone else. passing such harsh judgement only makes you the ass. just because you dont like implants or whatever doesnt give you the right to judge someone else for it. 

If it makes you happy do it.


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## triccc (May 10, 2007)

I think it's silly. I would rather get a car.


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## Raerae (May 10, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *triccc* 

 
_I think it's silly. I would rather get a car._

 
You get that at 15, so you can learn how to drive it b4 you get your liscense at 16, not at graduation


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## jerseygirl005 (May 10, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_You get that at 15, so you can learn how to drive it b4 you get your liscense at 16, not at graduation 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 
no, you get a new car after you graduation because when you are 15, you crash your PARENTS car, not yours 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 so when you're 18, you have experience driving. not that it won't stop you from crashing your new one, and daddy buying you another one.

oh the world some of you grew up in... i will never know and never want to know *laughs*


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## giz2000 (May 11, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *♥MiCHiE♥* 

 
_How do you know if you'll truly be flat-chested? I didn't get breasts until long after high school, after weight gain, birth control and finally being less active._

 
Me neither...mine came in during my late 20's after I had my son...they went from a low B to a full C/low D..the baby weight (it was not much, but still) went a long time ago...the boobs stuck around!  .Ya never know!!!


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## MAC_Pixie04 (May 11, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_How is this ANY different than getting a breast aug?  So it's OK for you to get a breast lift to get rid of saggy boobs, so you'll feel better about yourself.  While it's NOT ok for someone who has small breasts, to get an aug for the same reasons?

Nice double standard you have going there.



Not all of us want monstrous breasts eigther.  Just because you get an aug, doesn't mean you have to go from an A to a DD.  Not all of us wanna look like Posh Spice 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	


_

 
I don't have a double standard, if you read my post, I don't have anything against plastic surgery, except in the cases of young girls as graduation gifts because their bodies are still growing and it could be dangerous.  I didn't say it wasn't okay for someone to get plastic surgery if it makes them feel better.  A lot of girls that get implants after high school go for gold, at least 2 cup sizes if not more, which is a huge change to go through in a small amount of time.  I have friends and relatives that have had breast implants; do I think it's wrong? No. I never said that.  I don't appreciate you putting words in my mouth.

I simply say I don't agree with girls getting implants as graduation gifts, for the sake of the health of their still-developing bodies, and you take it to a new level and nearly call me a hypocrite because I might make the decision to have what i consider to be corrective surgery?  After losing the amount of weight I want/need to lose, the extra skin I risk having will make it very difficult for me to wear clothes properly and it adds weight to the body, weight I don't want or need. I'm not a 17 year old HS senior, my body is done developing.  I'm not going to grow anymore, my boobs are pretty much done growing except for what switching birth control or having children years ahead will do to them. My feet will stay their size until I lose weight, they'll get smaller. I'm 5'6" and I'm gonna stay 5'6" until I'm in my 70s and 80s, because then I'll be hunched over, so I'll be 5'4".

In case it wasn't clear, I'm not against plastic surgery in general, because eventually I plan to invest in correct procedures for myself, not just some quick fix to my body issues.  I don't agree with buying tits for a 17 year old girl whose body isn't done growing.


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## eulchen (May 11, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_So you dont appreciate your Christmas/Birthday presents because you didn't pay for them right?_

 
yes i do appreciate them, but ive seen way too many kids that dont have a clue bout money and what its worth and therefore do not appreciate the fact that such an OP cost thousands of dollars and what its actually worth. its just a gift from daddy, isnt it? thanks daddy. and im not even talking bout really rich kids, but some really spoiled people my age. my family was never poor but with things this expensive i support the view of my parents:

if you want to buy this, go earn the money.

(thats why i still have no car, its not necessary so i wont save for/buy one, unlike most of my classmates who got one from their parents)

from my own experience you appreciate things youve reached yourselves more than just getting it always handed to you on a silver plate. i love getting presents, i love making presents, but this is an appreciated extra. satisfaction primarily comes out of the things i worked my butt off for. 


if a person on this planet wants to have a plastic surgery, go ahead, get it, ill even support you, if you really want it. i dont want one for myself and therefore do not necessarily see the point in making such a change, but thats just my opinion which only affects my body. and the body of my children as i will surely not present them a plastic surgery as their graduation gift. if i have children one day in the future, that is. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




  on the other hand i have experienced quite often how fast young people can change their minds, and i do not think that theyre fully grown up (mentally wise) with 18 (i know this from personal experience). one could be doing something one will regret later. and even if its possible to change it afterwards, its been a lot of money thats down the loo. but hey, if you have it, go spend it if it makes you happy. 

all i was saying that I wouldnt do it.


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## Pirate (May 11, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Raerae* 

 
_Also what about people who got teased for having huge ears, or a huge nose, or a huge chin or whatever?  You know who those kids were.  They all had nicknames at school, and people made a POINT to make them aware that they looked different.  So surgery may be very good way to eliminating a constant reminder of something that was painful for a big part of their life._

 
Agreed. I myself used to be constantly teased in school because of my protruding ears. I`d love to get an Otoplasty and would absolutely jump at the opportunity to get it done.
People don`t realize how much kids with little imperfections such as prominent ears or a larger nose go through during their childhood. The constant teasing and ridicule from their peers can be very damaging, causing insecurity and low self-esteem.
I think if a person feels that they will be more comfortable with themselves after getting plastic surgery, then that`s fine. They`re the ones going under the knife, not you. If you`re completely comfortable in your own skin, then more power to you.

There`s more to plastic surgery than just a new pair of boobs.


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## lipstickandhate (May 11, 2007)

I always feel that people who are busy having plastic surgery have spent too much time looking in the mirror and not enough time in therapy. Everyone wants to get their nose tweaked or their breasts enlarged to "feel better about me!" but no one wants to suck it up and go to therapy where they might actually learn how to deal with the teasing they suffered in middle school or the way their mother made fun of their chin. 

I've got news, if your still scarred by the way the cool girls teased you about your jug ears or your wonky nose 10 years after the fact, your problem isn't your ears. Be happy you weren't born in Darfur or Bangladesh and step away from the mirror. 

And for the record, I have big-ass nose myself. Believe me, I know children can be cruel. But the beauty of being an adult is that your self esteem is no longer dependent on who gets picked last in dodge ball at recess. Grow up and move on.

Beauty isn't everything. It will eventually fade and you had sure as hell have something else going for you when it does.


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## lipstickandhate (May 11, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *macluver909* 

 
_
If it makes you happy do it._

 

This is why so many people are in prison, RaeRae.


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## Shimmer (May 11, 2007)

And what about the people like me for instance?
I couldn't give a shit less what people think about the size of my tits. 
However, *I* like nice C cups, AND I like fake breasts. On top of that, buying clothes for a woman with an A cup and a bubble butt (I'm not pear shaped by any stretch of the imagination, but I have a bubble butt, much like Britney Spears back in the day. Remember the Esquire shoot with the white sweater? Yeah, I have a bubble butt like that. It's not wide, it's bubbly...) is a pain in the ass. Buying clothes that fit the fact that I'm broader shouldered and flatter chested is a pain in the ass.


Besides, I'm admittedly vain, and I like proportion. 

I'd do it in a heartbeat, and it's not about therapy, low self esteem, or any other pseudopsychological 'condition'. 

I like boobs.
I like fake boobs.
I like boobs on me.
Therefore, I will get boobs. Know how that affects anyone else besides my husband and any female I decide to sleep with?

It doesn't.


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## lipstickandhate (May 12, 2007)

Raerae said:


> Realistically, everyone could benefit from a little nip tuck, QUOTE]
> 
> 
> Realistically, everyone could benefit from a little trip to the cognitive behavioral psychologist. Its easier to pump yourself full of saline than admit you've got mental issues and too much time to yourself though.


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## lipstickandhate (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_And what about the people like me for instance?
I couldn't give a shit less what people think about the size of my tits. 
However, *I* like nice C cups, AND I like fake breasts. On top of that, buying clothes for a woman with an A cup and a bubble butt (I'm not pear shaped by any stretch of the imagination, but I have a bubble butt, much like Britney Spears back in the day. Remember the Esquire shoot with the white sweater? Yeah, I have a bubble butt like that. It's not wide, it's bubbly...) is a pain in the ass. Buying clothes that fit the fact that I'm broader shouldered and flatter chested is a pain in the ass.


Besides, I'm admittedly vain, and I like proportion. 

I'd do it in a heartbeat, and it's not about therapy, low self esteem, or any other pseudopsychological 'condition'. 

I like boobs.
I like fake boobs.
I like boobs on me.
Therefore, I will get boobs. Know how that affects anyone else besides my husband and any female I decide to sleep with?

It doesn't._

 
That's fine. You're free to like fake tits. I personally don't and I wouldn't admire you or endorse your decision. Just like you, I have opinions about why people do things and what would be a better choice. I always think the best choice is to not have unnecessary surgery b/c of ideas about beauty, the fetishization of breasts or b/c I'm bored. And that's fine too. Just go to a hospital where they at least have back-up plans if something goes wrong. It's so creepy that people do it in a doctor's office somewhere.


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## Beauty Mark (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

  People don`t realize how much kids with little imperfections such as prominent ears or a larger nose go through during their childhood.  
 
Are you advocating that if a child goes up to his/her parent and requests plastic surgery that it's fine to let them go through with it?

Children are cruel, cruel beings a lot of the time. If they aren't making fun of you for how you look (odd proportions, height, beauty marks, hair, race, being too thin/fat, developing early/late), they'll make fun of you for anything they can think of. What you're wearing, what you're not wearing, how you speak, anything under the sun.

I would never, ever advocate changing yourself because of how cruel people can be and I certainly would never allow a child to undergo an unnecessary surgery just to stop the teasing.


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## Shimmer (May 12, 2007)

Not everyone who  gets elective  surgery is a basketcase.

Not everyone who wants to do it is for fetishist, ideas about beauty, or  boredom.

It's psychologically ingrained in the human brain to seek out symmetry and proportion. Aside from that, i like the way breasts fit and look under a top when proportional to the body they belong to.

There's nothing wrong with that, and to intimate or insinuate that there is is just plain...wrong, to be honest.


Agreed that having it done in a proper environment is important, however, in my case, I'm picky enough and experienced in the medical profession enough that I know what I want, what to look for, and how to get it done in the  safest and most beneficial manner. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




But please don't villify  the women who choose surgery for good reasons. They don't deserve it.


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## Beauty Mark (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

  It's psychologically ingrained in the human brain to seek out symmetry and proportion.  
 
There have been many studies done that the most beautiful faces are the ones that are most symmetric.

I think proportion is one of those biological things that helps indicate a good mate, but I'm not sure.


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## Shimmer (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_Are you advocating that if a child goes up to his/her parent and requests plastic surgery that it's fine to let them go through with it?

Children are cruel, cruel beings a lot of the time. If they aren't making fun of you for how you look (odd proportions, height, beauty marks, hair, race, being too thin/fat, developing early/late), they'll make fun of you for anything they can think of. What you're wearing, what you're not wearing, how you speak, anything under the sun.

I would never, ever advocate changing yourself because of how cruel people can be and I certainly would never allow a child to undergo an unnecessary surgery just to stop the teasing._

 
You say that, but have you been in that situation? Where your child comes home every day near tears because s/he was made fun of all day? Or, later in their education, around middle school, they start withdrawing from the groups because people make fun of the jug handles, or by high school, there's no true  socialization ever been achieved because the child has been the brunt of jokes and cruelty his or her entire life? By that tiime the damage to a child's self esteem is pretty severe, and it could have been avoided by a relatively simple surgery.


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## Shimmer (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_There have been many studies done that the most beautiful faces are the ones that are most symmetric.

I think proportion is one of those biological things that helps indicate a good mate, but I'm not sure._

 
Right.



My brother had a speech impediment growing up, couldn't say "L"s or "R"s at all...it was really really bad, and compounded by the fact that his first and middle names were comprised of both letters and our last name started with an R.

He was in speech until 6th grade.  In 7th grade he said fuck it. Some how he got over it, but now, if you even REMOTELY tease him in an Elmer Fudd voice he will rip your fucking throat out, shit down your neck and then feast on your bloody windpipe. 

You don't just 'get over' stuff you spend your entire life being  teased for. It doesn't just 'go away'.


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## Beauty Mark (May 12, 2007)

I was made fun of from elementary school through middle school for being Asian and short; my brother for being Asian and fat. It sucked but I got through it; asshole kids in public sometimes even make asshole comments towards me. If I had the ability to go back in time and change my eyes, get my height adjusted, etc., I would not. It would be a quick fix for a problem I'm glad that I learned to deal with: people are awful and you need to learn how to handle that. I had friends in school who were made fun of constantly for being Hindus, but I would never suggest they'd change religion.

If you want to change yourself through cosmetic surgery for yourself, good for you. However, I really don't think it's a good idea for children.

 Quote:

  You don't just 'get over' stuff you spend your entire life being teased for. It doesn't just 'go away'.  
 
Of course, it doesn't go away. Childhood pains of all kind haunt people. I just don't agree with the idea of changing yourself for other people. I think it's a terrible lesson. If you want to be completely plastic because that's what you want, good for you. If you're doing it to gain approval of others, I think it's a serious issue. Where will you stop?


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## Shimmer (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_I was made fun of from elementary school through middle school for being Asian and short; my brother for being Asian and fat. It sucked but I got through it; asshole kids in public sometimes even make asshole comments towards me. If I had the ability to go back in time and change my eyes, get my height adjusted, etc., I would not. It would be a quick fix for a problem I'm glad that I learned to deal with: people are awful and you need to learn how to handle that. I had friends in school who were made fun of constantly for being Hindus, but I would never suggest they'd change religion.

If you want to change yourself through cosmetic surgery for yourself, good for you. However, I really don't think it's a good idea for children.


Of course, it doesn't go away. Childhood pains of all kind haunt people. I just don't agree with the idea of changing yourself for other people. I think it's a terrible lesson. If you want to be completely plastic because that's what you want, good for you. If you're doing it to gain approval of others, I think it's a serious issue. Where will you stop?_

 
Therein is the crux of the problem. 

Cosmetic surgery for legitimate reasons vs cosmetic surgery for frivolous reasons...it's all subjective.


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## Beauty Mark (May 12, 2007)

Fair enough, but if I'm in the right mindset, I can legitimize anything.

To me, getting cosmetic surgery for other people's approval is terribly sad. Doing anything to get someone else's approval (from drugs to uptaking a hobby) is terribly sad.


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## Pirate (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Beauty Mark* 

 
_Fair enough, but if I'm in the right mindset, I can legitimize anything.

To me, getting cosmetic surgery for other people's approval is terribly sad. Doing anything to get someone else's approval (from drugs to uptaking a hobby) is terribly sad._

 
I agree with you on that. Also, I never meant to imply that children getting plastic surgery just to gain approval from others was okay.
That being said, I don't think children should get any type of cosmetic surgery. At their age they wouldn't know how permanent the changes are and I dont think they would be completely ready for it. If by the time they grow into adults and they would still like to go through with the surgery, then that's their choice. When I asked my mom for an otoplasty at age 13, she took one look at me and instantly said no. At the time I was upset, but now I see why she didnt let me do it and Im grateful that she was intelligent enough not to let me go under the knife at such an early age.


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## lipstickandhate (May 12, 2007)

Quote:

   Originally Posted by *Shimmer* 

 
_Not everyone who  gets elective  surgery is a basketcase.

Not everyone who wants to do it is for fetishist, ideas about beauty, or  boredom.

It's psychologically ingrained in the human brain to seek out symmetry and proportion. Aside from that, i like the way breasts fit and look under a top when proportional to the body they belong to.

There's nothing wrong with that, and to intimate or insinuate that there is is just plain...wrong, to be honest.


Agreed that having it done in a proper environment is important, however, in my case, I'm picky enough and experienced in the medical profession enough that I know what I want, what to look for, and how to get it done in the  safest and most beneficial manner. 
	

	
	
		
		

		
			





But please don't villify  the women who choose surgery for good reasons. They don't deserve it._

 
Perhaps I should have been more clear: I meant MANY women have problems- not all. Sloppy language. I certainly didn't mean to imply you!  You're entitled, as a grown woman with an education and many years of experience behind you, to make your own decisions about your body. I just feel for many people, it isn't an empowered informed decision but a real complex that would be best dealt with in another, non-surgical way. Sorry if I offended!


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## Shimmer (May 12, 2007)

No worries.


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## eulchen (May 12, 2007)

ice had sticking out ears since birth. when i was in school i had other children make jokes bout me. that later changed to making jokes bout some other things because i wasnt a cool kid in general but thats not the point of discussion here 
	

	
	
		
		

		
		
	


	




 however when i was under 10 years old doctors asked my parents if my ears should be operated. they looked at me and i just said "no". i stuck to getting picked on because i didnt want to suffer an OP.


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## glam8babe (Jul 6, 2007)

i dont see a problem with plastic surgery... as long as you dont end up like donatella versace!
i would love a breast augmentation [not till im about 20/21] my teeth whitened [not many people get this done in the UK] and probably when im 40+ botox because it looks good [not over done though!] i wouldnt get lipo because i can reshape my body by going to the gym and eating healthy and i wouldnt get a nose job or anything like that because my face is the way i look and i wouldnt wana change that


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## xsnowwhite (Jul 6, 2007)

i dont have a problem with it, but i know i'd way rather get something like a car for graduation rather than fixing my nose or something!


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## xIxSkyDancerxIx (Jul 6, 2007)

I personally don't agree with getting a boob job, but that doesn't mean I'm going to tell everyone around me not to do it and that it's wrong. Besides, even if I did, every person will do as he/she pleases. I believe that each person should feel good about him/herself regardless of how he/she looks, but I suppose I can only say that because I don't have a huge/glaring flaw (and if I do I don't see it lol). But I've seen a lot of kids I grew up with it, and it always made me a bit sad that we all have to go through school in a fairly hostile enviroment. But I think if you notice something really bad about yourself and it bothers you and depresses you, go ahead and change it. If it bothers you THAT MUCH.. then change it and start feeling better about yourself. 

However I think it's wrong for a senior to be getting a boob job as a graduation present. I think a laptop would be much more appropriate as a graduation gift. She's still growing and changing, not to mention the way we think changes drastically from 18 to 21, what if she doesn't want it later? I know you can always get them removed, but why not wait a little bit longer until your thinking is a bit more mature? (no offense to anyone) 

My friend had D's throughout high school and although she had a wonderful personality, very few of the guys who wanted to hook up with her wanted to for her personality. She would always be upset that they would "look down not up at me" but I never had this problem. Granted I didn't attract as much attention as she did, and I was slightly jealous, but now I feel a bit sorry for her (especially since she still has this problem). 

I agree with the proportion thing though. I have no hips but I have a pretty big butt for an asian, but my boobs are A cups. And I don't mind that they're small but I notice that my body is not proportional and it tugs at my mind, but oh well. I'm too scared to do it haha.


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